T56/TR6060 Coversion To 304

[NickVRParticipant AdelaideVR V8 Exec, VR SS, VF Redline Reserve View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 264]

After speaking to a few more people regarding my transmission issue it looks like I am better off getting the trans properly rebuilt. This will cost around the $3k-$3500 roughly (probably over quoting a little).

From what I have been told and a quick diagnosis of my problem and what my trans is I will need a proper rebuilt including a new converter, new trans pan with temp sensor plus gauge and a good trans cooler with fan to keep me from having a repeat of these issues. It also got me thinking about the cost to convert to a manual trans.

Now we all know the T5 is really known for it’s strength so that never crossed my mind. But the T56 would be the next option but got me thinking about the TR6060 as well. I am not sure on cost of getting this done but if by some miricale it wasn’t going to be much more then rebuilding my trans then I would seriously consider it.

Of the top of my head the list of parts/things to do woould be –

• Purchase T56/TR6060
• Pedal box (Hydraulic one, might already know where to get one)
• Adapter plate to mount to 304
• Clutch to suit conversion
• Tailshaft to suit
• Rear trans mount
• Wiring and/or new ECU and tune to suit.

Not sure if I have left anything out but trying to figure out the costing of getting this done. I am sure plenty of people have done this to either the V8 or V6 so there should be some info out there for it. I honestly don’t think it will be less than $4k but that’s where you guys come in. It may surprise me but I doubt it. If not the current trans will get a rebuild and I will happily stay auto.

[Slow355Participant Victoriahectic spec 355 vs ss ute View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 322]

If your lucky could get one that will bolt straight up to the 304, clutch is the expensive bit and finding a hydro pedal box

munch munch ls1s for lunch
Best 1/4 mile 13.1@105mph 60ft-1.8sec Reaction time .8 sec 0/100-4.8sec

[ImmortalityParticipant 97 HSV Senator 185i 02 VX L67 Calais View build HERE Member since: August 31, 2015 Posts: 535]

Instead of a adaptor plate you could get a bellhousing from Dellow they can be set up for either hydraulic or cable clutch.

http://dellowconversions.com.au/product/tremec-t-56-6-speed-to-holden-v8-253-308-bellhousing-2/

[exec24Participant 2004 VY S2 Berlina 1996 VS 5L Sedan View build HERE Member since: April 8, 2015 Posts: 435]

about a month too late, i just sold my hydraulic pedal box that i had, but if you interested i have a VS V8 Manual wiring harness and ECU here, i’ve only just listed it on ebay few days ago but yet to put pictures up

last one i spotted one on ebay sold for $600, was on ebay for less than a day, which is why i listed mine up at the same price

if your interested PM and i’ll do a better price

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  exec24.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  exec24.

[cava454Moderator 93 VR BT1 View build HERE Member since: February 20, 2015 Posts: 2 390]

Damn $600. I’ve got a a VR V8 manual loom. No ecu. Apparently they are even harder to find.

[sands vsParticipant vs commodore View build HERE Member since: March 1, 2015 Posts: 619]

Best bet would be trying to find a vn grpa box or vr/vs 215i 6 speed that will go strait in..

 

 

 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/121990493708?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  sands vs.

[VRSenator065Participant Adelaide SAVR Senator LSx454 1960 Kombi (project) 1921 Nash Hot Rod (future project) View build HERE Member since: February 17, 2015 Posts: 5 777]

$3k for a trans rebuild seems a little high?  Try giving Grant at Norwood Auto’s a call for a quote.  Not saying not to go manual btw, just want to make sure you are comparing apples with apples cost wise?

[exec24Participant 2004 VY S2 Berlina 1996 VS 5L Sedan View build HERE Member since: April 8, 2015 Posts: 435]

Paid about $2500 for mine without the stall

[VRSenator065Participant Adelaide SAVR Senator LSx454 1960 Kombi (project) 1921 Nash Hot Rod (future project) View build HERE Member since: February 17, 2015 Posts: 5 777]

^ yea fair enough, be interesting to know the full cost of manual conversion if you are paying someone to do it all?  I am guessing NickVR you don’t have the time/space to do it yourself?

[cava454Moderator 93 VR BT1 View build HERE Member since: February 20, 2015 Posts: 2 390]

Id allow $4k. For the conversion. + clutch if you want a good one.

 

$3500 for a t700 still seems high IMO

[NickVRParticipant AdelaideVR V8 Exec, VR SS, VF Redline Reserve View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 264]

exec24 wrote:

about a month too late, i just sold my hydraulic pedal box that i had, but if you interested i have a VS V8 Manual wiring harness and ECU here, i’ve only just listed it on ebay few days ago but yet to put pictures up last one i spotted one on ebay sold for $600, was on ebay for less than a day, which is why i listed mine up at the same price if your interested PM and i’ll do a better price

Not sure the VS stuff will be any good for mine as the BCM is different and may require a bit of work to get working properly. The hydraulic pedal box I reckon I can get and know of one for sale. Although still won’t be cheap and can vary from $3-$400.

VRSenator065 wrote:

$3k for a trans rebuild seems a little high? Try giving Grant at Norwood Auto’s a call for a quote. Not saying not to go manual btw, just want to make sure you are comparing apples with apples cost wise?

VRSenator065 wrote:

^ yea fair enough, be interesting to know the full cost of manual conversion if you are paying someone to do it all? I am guessing NickVR you don’t have the time/space to do it yourself?

cava454 wrote:

Id allow $4k. For the conversion. + clutch if you want a good one. $3500 for a t700 still seems high IMO

Norwood Automatics is the next place to try as recommend by a good mate of mine. Even better that they are closer to home too. Speaking to my mate he said to allow for about $3k to fix but should come in under that. But always allow for higher as you never know. Wouldn’t pay someone to do the conversion, would give it a go myself. Time doesn’t matter to me because the car can sit for as long as needed till fixed so no issue there. Space is not too bad, did an engine conversion in that space so a gearbox swap shouldn’t be too bad. Access to a hoist would be awesome and I could probably borrow one easily enough to get the box and tailshaft in at least but on the floor is where it would probably happen.

I am allowing $3-3.5k so I don’t get any surprises. I spoke a friend of mine who is quite the guru when it comes to Commodores and doing things properly he said about $2500-$3k. He suggested I speak to Norwoods as he is very fussy and anything he has needed or wanted they have delivered. Along with the suggestion of using Norwood Automatics he gave me a run down of what I would possibly be up for when repairing my trans.

• Fix the current trans kit and alter pressures so it is not only a hard shift from 1-2 but 3-4 as well. The current trans kit in it would more than likely be an off the shelf item fit with no modification.
• Deeper pan. More oil equals a better ability to keep the fluid cool. Able to fit trans temp sensor.
• New converter. Rebuilding the old one is not the best way about it. Getting a new one means a smaller converter and can be 2300rpm stall. The rebuilt unit will only go 21-2200 and not be that great.
•  New trans cooler. Just an Aeroflow one will do but fitting a fan to it and a gauge in the cabin too.This way I can keep an eye on temps and turn on the fans when the temp rises.
• Plus the repair of 3-4 clutch possibly a billet servo and other mods required to be better at handling any sort of power.

As for the manual conversion, had a quick brain storm with the same friend. To do it properly and finding a good condition box and doing things properly could cost about 5-6k. That is with a new or near new box and without taking small things that can come along the way. So potentially could cost more.

• Gear box – $1500-$2500
• Adaptor or New Bellhousing – $750 (Going by the above link)
• Clutch $1000-$2000 (Depending on type)
• ECU Wiring and speedo mod – $600-$?????
• Tailshaft – $500-$1000 (Only guessing with this one)
• Pedal Box – $300-$500 (Going rate for hydraulic pedal box)
• Cross Member to suit custom or of shelf if possible – $?????
• Master cylinder – $250+ (Quick Ebay search)
• Miscellaneous Items – $200-$400 (Bolts, Fluids and Labour to make or help modify where required)

Just using the cheaper prices on this quick brainstorm of things required and costings. The total will be a touch over $5k or nearly $7.5k on the dearer side of the equation without knowing the max cost on some things or costing at all. So between $5k and $8k at worst would be my guess.

Sorry for the essay, lol. If anyone thinks I have over quoted on any parts feel free to adjust it but I think that would be about right with in reason.

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.

[cava454Moderator 93 VR BT1 View build HERE Member since: February 20, 2015 Posts: 2 390]

So to clear it up your building a t700?

I know not close but ProMatics in Tullamarine built a t700 for a mate. New shell, Ptc internals etc for under $2500. The thing has copt a hiding, N bombs and all. Manual valve body or you thinking stage 2 shift kit to firm up the shifts? If you go manual valve body factor in a shifter

Converter do some shopping around you will get one for $500-700 for a quality unit.

Transcooler, save your $$ you don’t need a fan, but mount it in front of the radiator.

If you search around you could get a t56 conversion for around $2500-3000. If your car is somewhat standard to mildly worked a t5 will be more then enough also at around $1500ish.

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  cava454.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  cava454.

[exec24Participant 2004 VY S2 Berlina 1996 VS 5L Sedan View build HERE Member since: April 8, 2015 Posts: 435]

NickVR wrote:

Not sure the VS stuff will be any good for mine as the BCM is different and may require a bit of work to get working properly. The hydraulic pedal box I reckon I can get and know of one for sale. Although still won’t be cheap and can vary from $3-$400.

well the VR V6 manual ECU and the VR V8 Manual ECU manual are the same part numbers from i can remember while looking for mine

VS V8 Manual V8 ECU is the same again, but VS V6 has a different part no, so would be a different ECU

i only have an manual engine harness so might be able to adapt it if it needs it, where it plugs into the body harness

i sold my pedalbox, for $300, if i get time later tonight i’ll put the spec of my transmission up

 

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  exec24.

[cava454Moderator 93 VR BT1 View build HERE Member since: February 20, 2015 Posts: 2 390]

I have a VR v8 manual loom also

[VRSenator065Participant Adelaide SAVR Senator LSx454 1960 Kombi (project) 1921 Nash Hot Rod (future project) View build HERE Member since: February 17, 2015 Posts: 5 777]

I reckon your summary (aka essay!!) is spot on the money.  And I reckon the cost you have there are about right too.  Norwood’s are really really good.  I have got to know Grant, Chris and Scotty very well over the time I have been building mine.  They originally helped with some advice when I built my 4L65e, and they built my glide for me which is awesome.  They are very very honest, and know their stuff, you just have to see the kind of cars they always have coming and going there.  Actually my 4L65e and billet stall is sitting there looking for a new home if you were after a swap.  For you I would let it go at a pretty good price.  Its only done 1,000km, it was just the clutches couldn’t handle the torque of the 454, t has a lot of good bits in it.  Whichever way you go keep us posted how you go, its interesting to follow

 

 

[vs manta 218Participant Vs hsv manta View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 796]

I did the t56 conversion

I did $3k for a fresh rebuilt box from some gearbox company I can not remember now

All the rest was malwoods, $1700 for a ace option 3 clutch witch I would highly recommend, I’m pumping something like 460rwkw through it and holding up fine, billet slave cyilendar, remote blender, quick time shatter proof bell housing, under dash hydrolic clutch, billet resiviour braided line, a Th400-t56 tuff mount to a T5 cross member and 2 by 20mm spacers and a malwoods short throw middle mount shifter and front half of tail shaft and all bolts and bits required

All up every thing was $7k but that’s with very little expensive spared

(Not possitive on this but pretty sure but probley wrong ) i wouldn’t suggest finding a VR-vs t56 as they are hydrolic to cable and not the best clutch selections out there for them

Also wouldnt suggest a tr6060 as doin a t56 magnum would be better option

Not sure on zf6 speeds on how much they cost but am sure a magnum would compete with it strength wise and to even distroy a t56 takes serious power

End of the day get a t56 for $900-$1000, find a hydrolic clutch peddle and a bell housing as they are both $800 each, rest of the stuff is pretty good price from mal woods

[NickVRParticipant AdelaideVR V8 Exec, VR SS, VF Redline Reserve View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 264]

cava454 wrote:

So to clear it up your building a t700? I know not close but ProMatics in Tullamarine built a t700 for a mate. New shell, Ptc internals etc for under $2500. The thing has copt a hiding, N bombs and all. Manual valve body or you thinking stage 2 shift kit to firm up the shifts? If you go manual valve body factor in a shifter Converter do some shopping around you will get one for $500-700 for a quality unit. Transcooler, save your $$ you don’t need a fan, but mount it in front of the radiator. If you search around you could get a t56 conversion for around $2500-3000. If your car is somewhat standard to mildly worked a t5 will be more then enough also at around $1500ish.

That is about the figure I’m looking at for my rebuild $2.5-$3k. Its the electronic trans 4L60E in mine (i think that is what is in these). So they would be around the same price, but I always allow for more just in case. It has a shift kit in it but want to make sure it’s all good, no manual valve body. Just rebuild and strengthen what is there. Wouldn’t do the T5 conversion, would rather strengthen the auto with that cash.

exec24 wrote:

Not sure the VS stuff will be any good for mine as the BCM is different and may require a bit of work to get working properly. The hydraulic pedal box I reckon I can get and know of one for sale. Although still won’t be cheap and can vary from $3-$400.

well the VR V6 manual ECU and the VR V8 Manual ECU manual are the same part numbers from i can remember while looking for mine VS V8 Manual V8 ECU is the same again, but VS V6 has a different part no, so would be a different ECU i only have an manual engine harness so might be able to adapt it if it needs it, where it plugs into the body harness i sold my pedalbox, for $300, if i get time later tonight i’ll put the spec of my transmission up

Yeah, would be interesting to see what your trans spec is. Who did yours?

VRSenator065 wrote:

I reckon your summary (aka essay!!) is spot on the money. And I reckon the cost you have there are about right too. Norwood’s are really really good. I have got to know Grant, Chris and Scotty very well over the time I have been building mine. They originally helped with some advice when I built my 4L65e, and they built my glide for me which is awesome. They are very very honest, and know their stuff, you just have to see the kind of cars they always have coming and going there. Actually my 4L65e and billet stall is sitting there looking for a new home if you were after a swap. For you I would let it go at a pretty good price. Its only done 1,000km, it was just the clutches couldn’t handle the torque of the 454, t has a lot of good bits in it. Whichever way you go keep us posted how you go, its interesting to follow

Thanks for the offer of the stall but think would be too high for the cam in it. If the trans has the work done that I want in mine it could be an option. Have been recommended a 2300rpm stall for mine. But if Norwoods say otherwise then I’ll let you know.

vs manta 218 wrote:

I did the t56 conversion I did $3k for a fresh rebuilt box from some gearbox company I can not remember now All the rest was malwoods, $1700 for a ace option 3 clutch witch I would highly recommend, I’m pumping something like 460rwkw through it and holding up fine, billet slave cyilendar, remote blender, quick time shatter proof bell housing, under dash hydrolic clutch, billet resiviour braided line, a Th400-t56 tuff mount to a T5 cross member and 2 by 20mm spacers and a malwoods short throw middle mount shifter and front half of tail shaft and all bolts and bits required All up every thing was $7k but that’s with very little expensive spared (Not possitive on this but pretty sure but probley wrong ) i wouldn’t suggest finding a VR-vs t56 as they are hydrolic to cable and not the best clutch selections out there for them Also wouldnt suggest a tr6060 as doin a t56 magnum would be better option Not sure on zf6 speeds on how much they cost but am sure a magnum would compete with it strength wise and to even distroy a t56 takes serious power End of the day get a t56 for $900-$1000, find a hydrolic clutch peddle and a bell housing as they are both $800 each, rest of the stuff is pretty good price from mal woods

It isn’t just the clutch and box price I’m concerned with. It’s the other little things that add up. $7k is what I was thinking because I want to do it properly and do it once.

• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.
• This reply was modified 8 years, 6 months ago by  NickVR.

[VRSenator065Participant Adelaide SAVR Senator LSx454 1960 Kombi (project) 1921 Nash Hot Rod (future project) View build HERE Member since: February 17, 2015 Posts: 5 777]

If you speak to Norwoods, they know whats in my box. Not much more at the time i could have done to it ☺  but only if ya want it mate, no probs.

[NickVRParticipant AdelaideVR V8 Exec, VR SS, VF Redline Reserve View build HERE Member since: March 2, 2015 Posts: 264]

Yeah will speak to them. Hopefully yours has everything I want and it ends up being drive in and drive out. I think the trans is the same as mine.

[VRSenator065Participant Adelaide SAVR Senator LSx454 1960 Kombi (project) 1921 Nash Hot Rod (future project) View build HERE Member since: February 17, 2015 Posts: 5 777]

Yea 4L60e and 4L65e are externally similar.  I think yours will have a one piece case, the 4L65e has a stronger  two piece case, but they fit exactly the same, no mods whatsoever.  You should mention to Grant about what stall you want.  Mine can be modified to whatever stall rpm you want, and it has the lock up etc.  Just an option anyways.

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